I usually play grammar by ear (I never bothered to formally research the rules), so I don't understand why

"Thank you for inviting my family members and also I" and also "Thank you for inviting me and my family" both sound correct while

"Thank you for inviting I and my family" and also "Thank you for inviting my family members and me" both sound incorrect.

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The I vs me rule doesn't really help; "Thank you for inviting me" sounds correct "Thank you for inviting I" is obviously wrong.

Can anyone aid with this?


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"Thank you for inviting my family and also me"

Two things are going on below.

1> Almeans put yourself behind the various other perkid in a compound. So I, me, and so on always comes behind the other people - you, them, they, my friends, my family members, ... the list is endmuch less -- in English, you don't count for as a lot as the world you're linking to with a conjunction.

The second problem is really less complicated. Just think what you would say if there wasn't somepoint (someone) else linked to it. Would you ever before say, "Thank you for inviting I"? If not, then don't use 'I' simply bereason they invited someone else as well.


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level 2
· 9y

I've been making use of 'My friend and also I' for the longest time, largely bereason I was told that if you take the other perchild out of the sentence it alters the structure completely considering that you lose a subject/noun etc. Can someone please clarify this?


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level 1
· 9y
What you really must understand is that "I" is for as soon as you are doing the verb and "me" is for once someone is doing the verb to you. Because the inviting is being done to you, it's gotta be "me."


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level 1
· 9y

Well. What's happening is that the verb calls for somepoint in the objective instance to come after it. ‘My family’ is the very same whether it's subject or object, and if you usage ‘my household and also I’ as the object of a verb, bereason the household little comes initially it kind of ‘shields’ the I from sounding too strange. (It is still wrong, in conventional created English, but it's the kind of thing you will hear a lot in speech.) Whereas if ‘I’ comes immediately after the verb it's evident right amethod that it needs to be in the objective form ‘me’.


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level 2
· 9y

This is what threw me off, thanks!


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level 1
· 9y

If you pare the sentence down to its essentials, the rules become clearer. As you provided, "give thanks to you for inviting me" is correct because me is an object, not a subject. Thus, "give thanks to you for inviting my family, friends, poodle, pet fish and also me" is likewise correct.


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· 9y · edited 9y

We are talking about the corresponding indirect instance creates of what is "my family members and also I" and "I and also my family" in the (unstressed) direct case. "My family" doesn't readjust anymeans, yet the indirect instance create of "I" is "me".

Now the question is what happens when we put the two together and also we really desire the indirect situation of the conjunction. Langueras differ in just how they take care of this. English and also the major European languages put both parts in the instraight case before joining them. So the correct creates are " my household and also me" and also " me and my family". This is all tbelow is to say from an educated prescriptive point of see.

Nevertheless, so many kind of native speakers of English agree with your initial intuitions, that we cannot insurance claim that " my family members and I" is entirely wrong. What is more, considerable numbers of human being have actually been talking favor this for centuries. Clbeforehand tright here is some different grammatical pattern at work.

I guess there are many kind of ways the phenomenon deserve to potentially be described. To gain more indevelopment, it is finest to relocation "my family" by somepoint for which the direct object develop is not similar to the indirect object develop. A good example is " him/he and also me/I" / " me/I and also him/he", and via that there are some fascinating phenomena. See http://languagelog.ldc.upenn.edu/nll/?p=3469 for details and also for a discussion of possible explacountry.

My explacountry 1, which is comparable to some of those mentioned in the Language Log short article, claims that your grammatical dominance goes roughly as follows:

Direct object or indirect, stressed or unstressed, in English it's all the exact same (immutable) except for personal pronouns.

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When you sign up with words with "and", the result is never before a personal pronoun, also as soon as some of the constituents are individual pronouns. Because of this, also complicated constructions involving a pronoun are immutable. Either "my family members and also I" is correct regardmuch less of instance, or "my family members and also me" is correct regardmuch less of case, or both are correct regardless of instance. I.e., if one have the right to be supplied for X in "inviting X", then it can be supplied in "X invited" and also vice versa.

Now we have actually decoupled the case of "I"/"me" from the conmessage in which "my household and I/me" occurs, yet we need to still select in between "I" and "me". A typical choice in any kind of Indo-European language would be the straight object instance, so "I". This is the apparent choice if you have actually a little of formal grammar education and learning. On the various other hand also, English likewise offers the indirect object case, i.e. "me", as a stressed variant of the straight object instance. (E.g. in titles. Basically in the same situations where French uses "moi" instead of "je".) So that's additionally a perfectly great alternative. In general, "me" is even more idiomatic yet is rejected by many type of pedants who ssuggest deny that English has actually stressed variants of pronouns and prescribe: "Who is that? - I!"

My explanation also tells us why many type of native speakers, particularly children, say things choose "Me and my brother went fishing."

My different explacountry states that for some speakers, when a facility expression is in the indirect instance, only the first constituent gets marked as instraight case and the remainder continues to be in direct case. This predicts "invite him and she" as well as "invite her and also he" as 'correct'. If any aboriginal speaker really feels that these are correct (I doubt it), please speak up!

(This alternate explacountry is not completely insane. E.g. in Germale, as soon as you put a string of adjectives in front of a noun that is in the dative case, then only the first adjective -- or the post preceding it -- is in the dative instance, and also the others are in the nomiaboriginal case. That's similar and also weirder.)